DNA Study

[Elwood]

According to his Denver, Colorado death certificate, Joseph Antrim died in Denver on November 25, 1930, less than a week after Thanksgiving. When no one had claimed his body after four days, it was then transported to the Colorado Medical School on November 29, 1930 for medical research as a cadaver. Two days later, the Denver Post published the info about the burial permit for Joseph Antrim on December 1, 1930, on page 28.



The newspaper "Burial Permits" listing showed that Joe Antrim was age 76 and had resided at 1617 Larimer St. But, the age of 76 was reversed and should have been 67 (born in 1863). Two documents verify that Joseph Antrim was born in 1863; the 1916 Denver voter registration, and the 1920 Federal Census in Denver, which also shows he was the correct Joseph Antrim, as he resided on Larimer St. It also showed that Joseph Antrim was born in New York, his mother was born in New York, and his father was also born in New York. The 1880 Federal Census (in Colorado) also showed that Joseph's father was born in New York, but his mother was born in England. There are several newspaper articles that state that Joseph Antrim was the half brother of Billy the Kid.

Nov 20, 2019 2:23:23 GMT -5 @rufus said:

I'll add further to the naysayers who claim no DNA could be extracted from the graves.

If one ever looks up JAMES TOUR the world famous molecular chemist, he's announced not long ago that they've created a far more expansive test for determining not just family lineage but point of origin.

What's known as a "genetic electronic chip", that breaks down everything to the atoms and can determine precisely where you came from, etc.

Basically, all one needs is a bone and that'll be broken down to the atoms and see the entire genetic map of the individual; not unlike how a piece of metal is run through a laser and they can tell you that the metal was mined in a specific region of France 400 years ago.

Science has gone beyond DNA in the 21st century. As Tour points out, "For $100 you'll get your entire genetic code and everything that entails in an hour."

In the case of the bodies at Fort Sumner and Silver City, that's the most likely way to ever yield information from. Unless, of course, the bodies have completely dematerialized.

Jesus bless you all 😊

[BTK]

No way no how is brushy bill Roberts in any way shape form Billy the kid,,, there was no Billy Barlow ,,brushy bill was too young being born in 1879 verified by a Relative,,, he was first in phony j Frank dalton photo claiming he ran with the James gang when that got no pull then all this brushy bill farce started a year later Billy the kid was killed by pat garret in ft sumner in 1881 ask deluvina maxwell ask pete maxwell all gave testimony as also Billy’s friends Oliver p roberts or Oliver l Roberts whoever that phony was Was just trying to be famous and make a buck. He went before governor marbrey got every question wrong. The pat garret family wouldn’t even question him because he had no credibility just an older guy 71 looking for attention ..,,,

[BTK]

I understand Wayne lands position he runs the Billy the kid museum in hico he doesn’t wanna see his living dry up. Keep the farce the fakery going and he’s attached to the romanticism of having a very famous outlaw attached to his town but it’s a no. This guy brushy bill has been to Cuba Argentina been a sheriff rode with teddy roosevelts rough riders married 3 times never recognized huh ? Just an old guy trying to be something he’s not just a phony he’s been debunked by all historians and authors of real consequence pat garret yes was a coward and a man of very dubious reputation and he died for it getting shot in the back of his head in 1908 but sometimes history is history let the legend alone it has endured I can’t wait to see the next PHONY Billy pop up let’s see he’d be 170 could be bahahaha

[Wayne Land]

I have visited the museum in Hico and I met "Sue" Land who runs the museum. However, her last name and mine being the same is strictly coincidental. We are not related nor do I have any connection to the museum other than having visited back in 2006.

[kerry]

To assume Wayne owns the musuem in Hico - yet not give Brushy a fair hearing -
is a quite amusing...Belle Starr is not mentioned as an aquaintence of Brushy's-
this was where he met at least one of the Daltons and probably his uncle Jesse in their Indian Territory hideout....Brushy walked into the Territory and probably left the same way - he may have been looking for his father who knew all these
people and had stayed there himself...
I may be jumping to conclusions here -but at least its not a quantum leap in the dark!

[Deleted]

Jan 5, 2016 12:22:06 GMT -5 Texas Truth Teller said:

Waco Tribune-Herald, 15 January 1950

Brushy Bill Home From New York

Hico, Jan. 14 - SPL- O. L. (Brushy Bill) Roberts, one of six “corroborating witnesses” who are supporting J. Frank Dalton in his claims to being the real Jesse James, was due to return to Hico this week from New York, where he has spent the week with Dalton.
Roberts, who appeared on a radio program in New York Sunday night with other witnesses, claims to be 90 years old and to have known James in his banditry days. Dalton went to New York from Missouri to announce that he had filed suit to change his name to Jesse Woodson James.
Roberts was also a guest of Dalton’s last September when he attended his host’s 102nd birthday party at Meramec Caverns, Stanton, Mo He was given both trips with all expenses paid.
After living in this section as a boy, Roberts, who dresses in typical Western regalia, returned to Hico in 1941 to spend the rest of his life. He claims to have ridden in Wild West shows with Buffalo Bill Cody, to have broken wild cattle in South America, to have served as a Texas Ranger in 1891 and 1892, to have represented Texas as a horse rider in the Cheyenne Roundup of 1899, and to have worked on a Mexican ranch during the Mexican revolution. He carries pictures, relics, and documents to support his claims, and he has written his memoirs.
*****
"All these years I've been running and hiding." But he carried pictures, relics, and documents to support his claims?

Yes, I know that the newspaper said that, but if you listen to the voice recording of the interview done by NBC, Brushy does not at all claim to be a member of the James gang. He claims that his father fought with Quantrills Raiders with Jesse James and that he met Jesse James when he was 7. His voice matches the voice that people describe Billy the Kid as having and Brushy is very concise in his answers. While I do not support this anti-Brushy group I think that it is okay to post this, since they are the only ones that have a recording of his voice that I can find. www.facebook.com/brushybilldebunk/videos/for-those-that-would-like-to-hear-the-actual-voice-of-brushy-bill-this-is-a-reco/989034757788941/
I do not support this group, but this is the interview in question and while difficult to hear, you will notice that he does not claim to have been a member of the James Gang.

[Deleted]

May 13, 2019 22:13:10 GMT -5 Texas Truth Teller said:

lacowboy,
I read the book. I prefer biographies, and seldom read fiction.
Glad to see you acknowledge Brushy didn't say much of anything.
There are 2 credible records that prove the name of Billy the Kid's mother was Catherine McCarty. Of course, I cannot prove that she was never known as Katherine Bonney. Strange that you brought that up, since there is no evidence, much less proof, that James Henry Roberts, Mary Adeline Dunn, cousin Ollie Roberts, half-brother James Roberts ever existed. Unless, of course, you believe Brushy Bill. If so, you might be interested in investing in ocean front property in Arizona.

On the 1860 census in New York there are so many possible Billy the Kid's if you believe in accepted history as put forth by Garrett, Nolan, Utley and others that it is not even funny. It is a wonder that everybody in town did not have one another confused.

[Deleted]

Jun 23, 2021 17:14:38 GMT -5 BTK said:

I understand Wayne lands position he runs the Billy the kid museum in hico he doesn’t wanna see his living dry up. Keep the farce the fakery going and he’s attached to the romanticism of having a very famous outlaw attached to his town but it’s a no. This guy brushy bill has been to Cuba Argentina been a sheriff rode with teddy roosevelts rough riders married 3 times never recognized huh ? Just an old guy trying to be something he’s not just a phony he’s been debunked by all historians and authors of real consequence pat garret yes was a coward and a man of very dubious reputation and he died for it getting shot in the back of his head in 1908 but sometimes history is history let the legend alone it has endured I can’t wait to see the next PHONY Billy pop up let’s see he’d be 170 could be bahahaha

That is a bit uncalled for. There is ample evidence of Brushy being in the Rough Riders. There is ample evidence of him being most everywhere he says he was. I even have evidence of him being in the Black Hills of South Dakota as he said he was.

[MissyS]

Going back to Brushy’s claim of running with the James gang; there is a witness that saw the Kid meet with Jesse James in Las Vegas NM and gambled with him, whose to say Brushy didn’t run around with him while the two were both there? On another note, if it’s true the Kid rode with Jesse Evans at one time and if it’s also true that Jesse Evans real name was ‘Jesse James’ or ‘Jesse Robert James’ then Brushy could have been telling the truth about running with Jesse James, as it may be possible Brushy was referring to Jesse Evans when he made that claim?   

[tboor74]

If you read Dark Angel of Texas, the John Wesley Hardin story, and other similar books, it's amazing how many names associated with BTK and NM pop up in other states, often using aliases......there was plainly a lot of mingling went on, over great distance, and it's understandable that certain types of character would be drawn together.

[MissyS]

Jun 24, 2021 8:13:06 GMT -5 tboor74 said:

If you read Dark Angel of Texas, the John Wesley Hardin story, and other similar books, it's amazing how many names associated with BTK and NM pop up in other states, often using aliases......there was plainly a lot of mingling went on, over great distance, and it's understandable that certain types of character would be drawn together.

That’s a good point, I had been interested in what Jesus Silva said in his interview in the Amarillo Daily News, 1936 where he mentions a man that came to town of Fort Sumner on a fine horse they called “Butcher” and Billy stole his horse, interestingly the name “Butcher” was also a nickname used for Butch Cassidy, and reading about him, there is mention he may have ventured to New Mexico. 

[RonBk]

Jun 24, 2021 4:05:07 GMT -5 MissyS said:

Going back to Brushy’s claim of running with the James gang; there is a witness that saw the Kid meet with Jesse James in Las Vegas NM and gambled with him, whose to say Brushy didn’t run around with him while the two were both there? On another note, if it’s true the Kid rode with Jesse Evans at one time and if it’s also true that Jesse Evans real name was ‘Jesse James’ or ‘Jesse Robert James’ then Brushy could have been telling the truth about running with Jesse James, as it may be possible Brushy was referring to Jesse Evans when he made that claim?   

Both those scenarios are possible in my opinion. Also lets not forget it is possible Frank Dalton actually was Jesse James. After all a lot of people supported his claim, which has in fact never been disproven.

[tboor74]

The main issue with Dalton is his finger, I think it's been proven that Jesse James was missing his middle finger, from the first joint, on his left hand. Dalton had a mangled index fingertip. There's videos on youtube where you can clearly see Dalton's hand if you pause it at the right time......is it true re the finger though....not sure if it's 100% been proved. Dalton did have other info ie knowing the password to ask surviving gang members or associates for.
In my mind there's no doubt Dalton was very informed and involved with JJ no matter who he was....providing a possible link to BTK via the JJ meeting. As I said above, the spider's web of outlaws and aliases appears a huge tangle.

[DanJohno]

I've never had an interest in Jesse James but it's Dalton and his association with Brushy that has me slightly curious now. Also purely because TTT constantly says Dalton has no credibility I'm now starting to think maybe there's more to this Dalton guy than people think.

[RonBk]

Ive never really studied any details in the Dalton case. He certainly looked like Jesse James at least. It seems interesting also that there was no record of Dalton prior to 1930 if thats correct?