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Post by Wayne Land on Sept 1, 2021 17:43:07 GMT -5
Let's just pretend for a moment that Brushy Bill was the real Oliver Pleasant Roberts (NOT). How is it ol' Oliver P. became known as "Brushy Bill"? How and when did he get that nickname? What is the earliest record of that nickname being used? I'm just wandering because those who do believe Brushy was the real Oliver P. need to be able to answer those questions, I think.
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Post by tboor74 on Sept 2, 2021 3:07:43 GMT -5
I love this question Wayne, no matter anyone's thoughts on Brushy / Billy I'm intrigued by OP as many of the 'tall tales' do stand up' but there's supposedly no way OP could have done them. The OP backstory, or where his backstory came from, is compelling.
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Post by DanJohno on Sept 5, 2021 8:56:04 GMT -5
Such a good question. I hope Young Guns 3 is about Billy's transition into Brushy Bill.
It is a really important question.
If he really was just Oliver Pleasant Roberts then why on earth did everyone call him Bill?!
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Post by kerry on Sept 6, 2021 3:05:26 GMT -5
Such a good question. I hope Young Guns 3 is about Billy's transition into Brushy Bill. It is a really important question. If he really was just Oliver Pleasant Roberts then why on earth did everyone call him Bill?! George Curry was about the same age as BTK and died in 1947..he claimed to have met BTK -in his distinguished life he had been sherriff of Lincoln, an officer in the Rough Riders,Territorial Governor,Congressman and finally State historian of New Mexico..he was a friend of Pat Garrett's but trusted by Oliver Lee....if,Brushy seriously sought a pardon prior to Curry's death - then this was his man....did they meet again during their military service ? As State historian at the time Lincoln court house became a monument - it would seem George Curry held all the cards ...one way or another. |
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Post by DanJohno on Sept 6, 2021 8:20:59 GMT -5
Such a good question. I hope Young Guns 3 is about Billy's transition into Brushy Bill. It is a really important question. If he really was just Oliver Pleasant Roberts then why on earth did everyone call him Bill?! George Curry was about the same age as BTK and died in 1947..he claimed to have met BTK -in his distinguished life he had been sherriff of Lincoln, an officer in the Rough Riders,Territorial Governor,Congressman and finally State historian of New Mexico..he was a friend of Pat Garrett's but trusted by Oliver Lee....if,Brushy seriously sought a pardon prior to Curry's death - then this was his man....did they meet again during their military service ? As State historian at the time Lincoln court house became a monument - it would seem George Curry held all the cards ...one way or another. I like all your posts in this forum Kerry. Are you a writer? All your posts are interesting, thought provoking and exciting to read. You have alot of good theories and your knowledge is very impressive. |
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Post by leeb on Sept 6, 2021 13:01:38 GMT -5
I also like reading Kerry's posts but also like the word theories. Everything feeds the brushy frenzy but actually factually every post is just a conspiracy theory. Great politician.
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Post by texas truth teller on Sept 6, 2021 16:40:38 GMT -5
Such a good question. I hope Young Guns 3 is about Billy's transition into Brushy Bill. It is a really important question. If he really was just Oliver Pleasant Roberts then why on earth did everyone call him Bill?! George Curry was about the same age as BTK and died in 1947..he claimed to have met BTK -in his distinguished life he had been sherriff of Lincoln, an officer in the Rough Riders,Territorial Governor,Congressman and finally State historian of New Mexico..he was a friend of Pat Garrett's but trusted by Oliver Lee....if,Brushy seriously sought a pardon prior to Curry's death - then this was his man....did they meet again during their military service ? As State historian at the time Lincoln court house became a monument - it would seem George Curry held all the cards ...one way or another. More about George Curry: FAG Memorial #708995 U.S. Congressman, New Mexico Governor. Born on a plantation, near Bayou Sara, Louisiana, he moved to the Territory of New Mexico in 1879 and worked on a cattle ranch until 1881. He engaged in the mercantile and stock business, was deputy treasurer of Lincoln County, (1886-87), county clerk in 1888, county assessor in 1890, County Sheriff in 1892 and was a member of the Territorial State Senate, (1894-96). During the Spanish-American War, he served as a Captain in Roosevelt’s Rough Riders, the 1st Volunteer Cavalry. After the war, he was Sheriff of Otero County New Mexico, when he resigned to join the 11th Volunteer Cavalry, as provost marshal and provost judge, in the Philippine Islands, (1899-1901). He also was Governor of the Province of Camarines, Philippine Islands, in 1901, chief of police of the City of Manila, 1901, Governor of the Province of Isabela, (1903-1905) and was Governor of the Province of Samar, (1905-07), when he resigned. Returning to America, he was elected Governor of the Territory of New Mexico, serving (1907-11). Upon the admission of New Mexico as a State into the Union, he was elected as a Republican to the Sixty-second Congress, serving (1912-13). Declining to be a candidate for re-nomination, he engaged in the hotel business, was a private secretary to US Senator Holm O. Bursum of New Mexico, (1921-22) and was a member of the International Boundary Commission, (1922-27). He then moved to a ranch near Cutter, New Mexico and was a State historian until his death at age 86 in Albuquerque, New Mexico. The bio is not completely accurate, for George was a clerk in Ford County, Kansas, on the 15th day of June, 1880. Did he meet BtK? Possible. When and where did he meet BtK? George Curry was a clerk in Dodge, Ford County, Kansas, when the 1880 census was recorded. There were 45 soldiers listed on the same census page. The birthplace of his parents were consistently reported as Kentucky for his father and Ireland for his mother in the 1870, 1880, and 1920 census records. |
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Post by kerry on Sept 6, 2021 18:22:34 GMT -5
George Curry was about the same age as BTK and died in 1947..he claimed to have met BTK -in his distinguished life he had been sherriff of Lincoln, an officer in the Rough Riders,Territorial Governor,Congressman and finally State historian of New Mexico..he was a friend of Pat Garrett's but trusted by Oliver Lee....if,Brushy seriously sought a pardon prior to Curry's death - then this was his man....did they meet again during their military service ? As State historian at the time Lincoln court house became a monument - it would seem George Curry held all the cards ...one way or another. More about George Curry: FAG Memorial #708995 U.S. Congressman, New Mexico Governor. Born on a plantation, near Bayou Sara, Louisiana, he moved to the Territory of New Mexico in 1879 and worked on a cattle ranch until 1881. He engaged in the mercantile and stock business, was deputy treasurer of Lincoln County, (1886-87), county clerk in 1888, county assessor in 1890, County Sheriff in 1892 and was a member of the Territorial State Senate, (1894-96). During the Spanish-American War, he served as a Captain in Roosevelt’s Rough Riders, the 1st Volunteer Cavalry. After the war, he was Sheriff of Otero County New Mexico, when he resigned to join the 11th Volunteer Cavalry, as provost marshal and provost judge, in the Philippine Islands, (1899-1901). He also was Governor of the Province of Camarines, Philippine Islands, in 1901, chief of police of the City of Manila, 1901, Governor of the Province of Isabela, (1903-1905) and was Governor of the Province of Samar, (1905-07), when he resigned. Returning to America, he was elected Governor of the Territory of New Mexico, serving (1907-11). Upon the admission of New Mexico as a State into the Union, he was elected as a Republican to the Sixty-second Congress, serving (1912-13). Declining to be a candidate for re-nomination, he engaged in the hotel business, was a private secretary to US Senator Holm O. Bursum of New Mexico, (1921-22) and was a member of the International Boundary Commission, (1922-27). He then moved to a ranch near Cutter, New Mexico and was a State historian until his death at age 86 in Albuquerque, New Mexico. The bio is not completely accurate, for George was a clerk in Ford County, Kansas, on the 15th day of June, 1880. Did he meet BtK? Possible. When and where did he meet BtK? George Curry was a clerk in Dodge, Ford County, Kansas, when the 1880 census was recorded. There were 45 soldiers listed on the same census page. The birthplace of his parents were consistently reported as Kentucky for his father and Ireland for his mother in the 1870, 1880, and 1920 census records. Thanks 3T -that needed saying...really impressive record.Did he pardon Dave Anderson at Pat Garrett's request -after Pat had been denied the Prison Superintendent position? Anderson(Billy Wilson) had only skipped a few years for counterfeiting (for which he probably was'nt guity anyway) and went on to become a sherrff so popular - the town folk lynched the man who shot him dead,, |
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Post by kerry on Sept 6, 2021 18:54:19 GMT -5
I also like reading Kerry's posts but also like the word theories. Everything feeds the brushy frenzy but actually factually every post is just a conspiracy theory. Great politician. Thanks Danjohno and Leeb for the kind words...Iam no writer nor politician- and if I were a historian...my interest would be Clay Allison. He was a bigger thorn in the side of the Santa Fe Ring in Colfax County than the vendettas triggered by Jimmy Dolan in Lincoln. They had thousands of intractable miners around Elizabeth Town...the Governor and military were called in more than once. Clay Allison left little to the imagination -except for his miltary carreer with General Forrest...and perhaps a potential encounter in 1878 which would have left the Earps one man short at the Ok Carral... |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 6, 2021 21:06:09 GMT -5
That is a good question, Wayne. I do not know of a good answer of how or why he would have come up with the name. Hunting? That would be a wild guess and of course, I know that is not how he got the name Brushy Bill, but that was my best shot at coming up with a guess. I like how the question gets one to think. Seems really implausible that a fellow named Oliver Pleasant would obtain the nickname Brushy Bill.
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Post by MissyS on Oct 4, 2021 21:25:16 GMT -5
I found mention that Brushy had acquired the nickname Brushy Bill while he and a pal were working for three or four years as a guard and scout for a stage line in Black Hills South Dakota during the winter of 1884, he rode through Brushy Hills in the region and so took the name “Brushy Bill”. There was gold discovered in the Black Hills in 1876, and it’s very possible and believable that guards and scouts were hired to ride alongside stages in that region for some time, I don’t know how long the gold rush lasted in that region after the discovery?, but I’m guessing it had to been dangerous travel even eight years afterward in that region. I don’t know if this is truly how Brushy got his nickname or not?  |
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Post by Wayne Land on Oct 5, 2021 9:13:55 GMT -5
Interesting post Missy. But "if" that truly is where the nickname came from, how did Oliver Pleasant Roberts get that name? Was he working as a guard and scout for a stage line in the Black Hills in 1884? Not likely. He was only 5 years old at that time. So, I'm looking for some Brushy naysayer to be able to suggest how ol' Oliver P. got that name and when.
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Post by MissyS on Oct 5, 2021 16:41:49 GMT -5
I apologize, Wayne  I was looking up an early time the nickname was used not specifically ol’ Oliver P., you present a very good challenge for any naysayer to answer. |
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Post by tboor74 on Oct 6, 2021 2:34:46 GMT -5
This point is a bugbear of mine. Completely ignoring the BTK angle, how did Brushy seemingly do all these things whilst the general concensus is he never strayed far from home his whole life. I've had chats with many on this board who are far more knowledgeable than me and their facts fill in many, many blanks, but I'm still intrigued by Brushy's life....whoever he is / was.
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I was looking up an early time the nickname was used not specifically ol’ Oliver P., you present a very good challenge for any naysayer to answer.