photo comparison study in 1990

[clydec]

I recently emailed Professor Alan Bovik who was one of the two professionals who did the comparison study between the photo of brushy and the billy the kid tintype.  It's an eye opener for me because this study was not reported properly in the media and in the books written about brushy after.  Here is my email to professor Bovik and his response to me:  

"Hi Dr. Bovick, My name is Clyde
Carpenter and I am a member
 of a Facebook group called
"Cold West Investigations". We discuss old west  history, mysteries and events.
 As you can imagine whenever

 the subject of Billy the kid and whether or not he survived

 the shooting by Pat Garrett comes up the discussion gets

 lively. I was wondering if it would be possible to get

 some information about the comparison study that you and Dr.

 Acton undertook back in 1990? If you could email me some

 information on the study that would be great, if not is

 there somewhere online where I can access this

 information. Is it your opinion Dr. Bovick that Brushy

 Bill Roberts and Billy the kid are the same man? Thank

 you.

Here is his reply to me:  "Not at all conclusively same. The face

recognition tools were quite crude back then, and we came to

no positive conclusion. However, the fellow that asked us

then mis-stated our conclusions in support of the conclusion

that he was indeed billy the kid. We reported him and he was

barred from using billy the kid materials by the folks he

falsely reported the information to.

>



> Somehow it has appeared on the

Internet (the false conclusion).

>

> I have long forgotten about this and have

no data but perhaps Prof Acton can help you out.

>

> Based on my

eyeballs, I'd say brushy bill was just brushy bill.

[clydec]

So I emailed Dr. Bovik again for some clarification. Here is my second
email to him: "Thanks for the quick response Professor Bovik, That is really
interesting. So just for clarification, was there a 93
percent match of the brushy photo as an old man to the billy
the kid tintype? If so, is that a good match? Was the
remark attributed to yourself and Professor Acton that
"The resemblance between the two men is indeed
amazing" accurate? Also, was the remark that
"The remaining 7 percent can be attributed to age and
missing teeth" accurate? Did either yourself or
Professor Acton say that history needs to be rewritten or
is this a false statement?

Here is his response:

"I Don't remember the
93%, ask Scott. But the features used back then were
archaic, and that figure would mean nothing today.

I did not say any of those
those things, and do not believe them either."

[mikegolfpro]

Thanks for posting Clydec. Very interesting but it was a long time ago and the technology has changed quite a bit since that time. I do like Wayne's comparisons on his website that he has done. I wonder myself what the other other Professor may say on this subject. If he has any rememberances of the procedures. Very interesting!

[jammartinez760]

it was really interesting thank you for this

[Wayne Land]

This is exactly why I did my own comparisons in the first place. I had read several different accounts of different comparisons that were done with varying conclusions reached. There was a TV special some years ago that had a retired FBI "expert" perform the comparison allegedly used by the FBI. He said they could not be the same man, but in my honest opinion the test was not valid. Why? Am I questioning the almighty FBI itself? No, I'm not questioning the FBI. I'm questioning the former FBI employee who used a picture of Brushy as an old man (no teeth in his head) and then said they couldn't be the same person because the distance from the lip to the chin was less on Brushy. I don't care who you are, that is a flawed comparison in my mind. So being somewhat adept at the use of computer applications, I undertook my own comparison. I don't see anything different about the two faces that could not be explained by the age difference or the clarity of the photo. Notice his comment "the face recognition tools were quite crude back then".

I sure would love to know what Dr. Bovik has to say about it. But thanks so much for sharing the info.

[clydec]

Wayne, he did not say that they were not close, just that he could not remember the percentage of match. Doctor Acton never got back to me on the subject. I got the distinct impression from Doctor Bovick that they had taken some heat for this study from the Historians and experts and probably felt it was better left alone, just my opinion. There was another Professor from a different university, Dr. Jurkins I believe that did a similar study as the first one and came back with results that were a very close match. I tried to find him online and contact him, but could not find any information on him.

[MissyS]

I thought I would post this about a study mentioned had been done in The Lost Interviews book, it may be the same one that was carried out if so I apologize, I hate to post scientific wordings that are confusing,  but it says it was done based on techniques developed by Kaya and Kobayashi, and was conducted at the Visions Systems and Advanced Graphic Laboratory at the University of Texas at Austin, it says the analysts examined digitally measured facial features such as intrapupillary distance, internal bi- ocular breadth, external bi- ocular breadth, nose breadth, bizygomatic breadth which is the cheek bones, mid lip to chin distance, mid lip to nose distance, and nose length, those measurements yielded a remarkable likeness, and a low mean standard error, whatever that means? according to one of the analysts stated the similarity between the facial structures of Roberts and Billy The Kid were amazing, the few discrepancies in the measurements were explained away by missing teeth and weight. Clydec mentioned Age as a factor, I wanted to point out about the weight as another factor mentioned by this study. I really didn't want to change the subject of Brushy's facial comparison, but I saw where an age regression was done on a Jack the Ripper suspect on a show televised recently, I don't know if it's new? they used a software that took away forty or fifty years or so off a photo of an aged suspect to compare it to a drawing of a younger man, it would be really cool if a photo of Brushy could be aged regressed 70 yrs off and compare it to Billy, or add 70 years to Billy's photo and see if it looks like Brushy. I wonder if it could be done?

[clydec]

It is the same study Missy. Yes, that would be amazing if we could use a photo of an older brushy and take 50 or 60 years off of him. The photo of him at 28 or 29 is a close likeness to billy, but there is still a 10 year gap there from the tintype of Billy and he has added some weight and Muscle and the mouth dash. I have started a Brushy Bill roberts page on Facebook Missy, you should drop by and check it out. Here is the address, www.facebook.com/groups/974603372714969/?source_id=113450325985517

[MissyS]

Thanks Clydec,
Sorry, I didn't know if that study was the same or not? If an age regression on an older Brushy could be done, then maybe it would be good to do one on Miller also, I don't know who or how or where to even ask about getting it done? But it would be interesting of the outcome, and thank you for the link to your Brushy page 

[DanJohno]

Brushy Bill Roberts AKA Billy The Kid: Physical Similarities & Facial Recognition Study / Brett Hall
www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y8KpyQTdBfk

[Jeffy Dolmer The Ringer]

Jan 31, 2022 9:19:36 GMT -5 DanJohno said:

Brushy Bill Roberts AKA Billy The Kid: Physical Similarities & Facial Recognition Study / Brett Hall
www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y8KpyQTdBfk

Brett Hall is selling a Brushy Bill Roberts is Billy the Kid book. He believes that 1990 photo recognition study proves Brushy is Billy. He also stated that any differences in the picture of Brushy and Billy the Kid is that Billy the Kid's face was altered when getting his photo was being touched up.