Post by WhisperingBillyBarlow on Oct 31, 2023 4:47:49 GMT -5
As promised, I said I would do a break down of the documentary that Mr Edwards produced just like I did for the "Last Trial of Billy The Kid" documentary that the Back to Billy channel did.
First, I watched the Bonus Footage. First take, it appears to be from a specific timeframe in history because of the hydraulic mining equipment. However, it must be pointed out there is still small scale hydraulic mining operations ongoing in the United States today. Yes, in 1884 hydraulic mining was banned in California but there was resurgences of the practice in California after 1893.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydraulic_mining
So I'll be generous: the photo must have been taken from between 1853 when it was first used by Edward Matteson and roughly 1909/1910 which covers a period of 56-57 years or so. So, certainly within the right timeframe for Billy The Kid.
From the appearance of the person's in the photo, I look at the clothing. It looks like the kind of clothes people wore from the time period. The shovel in the background seems to fit the timeframe because the metal in the shovel goes up higher than shovels today; equipment back then was built to last, as they were over-engineered to get more use out of them than the junk we use today.
So to my untrained eye, with limited knowledge, it appears to be an authentic photograph from the late 19th or early 20th century. I don't mind the photo being in mint condition, there's plenty of photographs that are as old as this or older in similar condition. Especially if that photo basically was kept hidden away in a dark or dimly lit place for decades.
Anyways on to the actual documentary itself:
1- Was not aware William Antrim left Indiana specifically for the purpose of being a mining prospector. That would make sense retrospectively considering the Oklahoma land grab, California gold rush, etc at the time. I'm reminded of Matthew Russell Birdwell, the step grandfather of Brushy Bill Roberts, being a prospector and cattleman with land all over Texas & Arizona & Nevada.
2- It's not until 6:29 of the video do we see the photo in question. Estevez says "definitively proven" that the two other persons in the photograph are identified by Michael Furia of NYC. Furia, according to a standard Google search, appears to be a man for hire as his LINKEDIN profile suggests:
My issue or problem is if the man actually is for hire, is it possible that a man for hire could simply give you the results you wanted? I couldn't find much more information on Furia, so I'm not sure if he could really be called a "world renowned expert" as Estevez said in the documentary. I will have to dig further on any potential cases Furia actually solved with his facial recognition techniques.
3- The photo was discovered in Canada from a couple who purchased a bunch of photos from an antique store. I'm reminded of the croquet photo and the card playing photo. Both were found under similar circumstances. On the back of the photo was the words "Billy The Kid." They approached Edwards with the photograph asking if he could help identify their photo.
4- Reported pictures of Billy The Kid's mother are allegedly mislabeled by historians. Nobody allegedly knows what Katherine Antrim actually looked like. Apparently Maggie Keays was the woman in the photographs thought to be Katherine Antrim. Keays grew up in Canada not far from where the photograph was found. In the 1870s she became a mail order bride and married a man named Levi Miller, a blacksmith and prospector, and they lived in Silver City New Mexico.
5- Apparently hydraulic mining was widely used in the 1870s in New Mexico. When this actually stopped, needs further investigation (imho) to give a far more accurate date/timeline.
6- Edwards maintains he wanted to find a completely unbiased individual to identify the photograph, and Furia allegedly did not know who Billy The Kid was or never heard of the name Billy The Kid. I find that to be odd considering the tintype is one of the most recognizable pictures in American history and the name Billy The Kid is as well known as George Washington or Abraham Lincoln. I already addressed issues/concerns previously on the #2 point of contention.
7- Furia himself admits that you can never say somebody is 100% the person in question. They can only say 99.9% for legal reasons, essentially, although there is always a margin of error in these types of investigative techniques. Furia also says that he is developing new techniques, which sounds great but these must be considered experimental works in progress until scientifically verified to be reliable.
8- Maggie Keays-Miller and the Katherine Antrim photos were compared, to which Furia said all four photos were the same woman at different stages of life. Then he compared those with the Silver City New Mexico photo and said he believed Maggie was in thar photograph.
9- Known photos of Levi Miller are compared to the Silver City photo, and ruled out William Antrim as being in the photo. Furia believes Levi Miller is in the Silver City New Mexico photograph but because of slight blurring in the photograph he could not emphatically say it was Levi Miller like he did Maggie Keays.
10- Furia is shown multiple pictures of Brushy Bill Roberts at various stages of life and compared it to the Silver City New Mexico photo. Where I have issue at this point is Edwards using (among the photographs) was 2 picture of one of the Rough Riders, telling Furia that they're all the same man, and Furia does not once counter that narrative. The Rough Riders picture has NEVER been proven to be Roberts, and shouldn't have been included. That casts doubt itself on Furia saying Brushy Bill Roberts was a match to the Silver City New Mexico photograph. Edwards should've only used only known pictures that are proof positive of Brushy Bill Roberts. It raises more questions than answers about Furia's capabilities, or the power of suggestion influencing expert opinion.
11- The Silver City New Mexico photo was then compared to the famous tintype and he ruled in favor of the tintype being a match to the Silver City New Mexico photo.
12-
Conclusion: Edwards, in my opinion, overplayed his hand and unfortunately tainted the expert opinion of Furia by interjecting the Rough Riders photos and Roberts photos into the analysis. What needs to be done is a second opinion from a university or department, with no connection to Dan Edwards. I suggest the couple in Canada need to take the photo to their local university department of history and have them use their own panel of experts to prove the photo is Billy The Kid, Levi Miller and Maggie Keays. I think the provenance is there (photo in Canada nearby where Keays grew up) to give it credibility, but Edwards jumped the gun on the whole issue.
Jesus Christ Almighty God bless you all
First, I watched the Bonus Footage. First take, it appears to be from a specific timeframe in history because of the hydraulic mining equipment. However, it must be pointed out there is still small scale hydraulic mining operations ongoing in the United States today. Yes, in 1884 hydraulic mining was banned in California but there was resurgences of the practice in California after 1893.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydraulic_mining
So I'll be generous: the photo must have been taken from between 1853 when it was first used by Edward Matteson and roughly 1909/1910 which covers a period of 56-57 years or so. So, certainly within the right timeframe for Billy The Kid.
From the appearance of the person's in the photo, I look at the clothing. It looks like the kind of clothes people wore from the time period. The shovel in the background seems to fit the timeframe because the metal in the shovel goes up higher than shovels today; equipment back then was built to last, as they were over-engineered to get more use out of them than the junk we use today.
So to my untrained eye, with limited knowledge, it appears to be an authentic photograph from the late 19th or early 20th century. I don't mind the photo being in mint condition, there's plenty of photographs that are as old as this or older in similar condition. Especially if that photo basically was kept hidden away in a dark or dimly lit place for decades.
Anyways on to the actual documentary itself:
1- Was not aware William Antrim left Indiana specifically for the purpose of being a mining prospector. That would make sense retrospectively considering the Oklahoma land grab, California gold rush, etc at the time. I'm reminded of Matthew Russell Birdwell, the step grandfather of Brushy Bill Roberts, being a prospector and cattleman with land all over Texas & Arizona & Nevada.
2- It's not until 6:29 of the video do we see the photo in question. Estevez says "definitively proven" that the two other persons in the photograph are identified by Michael Furia of NYC. Furia, according to a standard Google search, appears to be a man for hire as his LINKEDIN profile suggests:
My issue or problem is if the man actually is for hire, is it possible that a man for hire could simply give you the results you wanted? I couldn't find much more information on Furia, so I'm not sure if he could really be called a "world renowned expert" as Estevez said in the documentary. I will have to dig further on any potential cases Furia actually solved with his facial recognition techniques.
3- The photo was discovered in Canada from a couple who purchased a bunch of photos from an antique store. I'm reminded of the croquet photo and the card playing photo. Both were found under similar circumstances. On the back of the photo was the words "Billy The Kid." They approached Edwards with the photograph asking if he could help identify their photo.
4- Reported pictures of Billy The Kid's mother are allegedly mislabeled by historians. Nobody allegedly knows what Katherine Antrim actually looked like. Apparently Maggie Keays was the woman in the photographs thought to be Katherine Antrim. Keays grew up in Canada not far from where the photograph was found. In the 1870s she became a mail order bride and married a man named Levi Miller, a blacksmith and prospector, and they lived in Silver City New Mexico.
5- Apparently hydraulic mining was widely used in the 1870s in New Mexico. When this actually stopped, needs further investigation (imho) to give a far more accurate date/timeline.
6- Edwards maintains he wanted to find a completely unbiased individual to identify the photograph, and Furia allegedly did not know who Billy The Kid was or never heard of the name Billy The Kid. I find that to be odd considering the tintype is one of the most recognizable pictures in American history and the name Billy The Kid is as well known as George Washington or Abraham Lincoln. I already addressed issues/concerns previously on the #2 point of contention.
7- Furia himself admits that you can never say somebody is 100% the person in question. They can only say 99.9% for legal reasons, essentially, although there is always a margin of error in these types of investigative techniques. Furia also says that he is developing new techniques, which sounds great but these must be considered experimental works in progress until scientifically verified to be reliable.
8- Maggie Keays-Miller and the Katherine Antrim photos were compared, to which Furia said all four photos were the same woman at different stages of life. Then he compared those with the Silver City New Mexico photo and said he believed Maggie was in thar photograph.
9- Known photos of Levi Miller are compared to the Silver City photo, and ruled out William Antrim as being in the photo. Furia believes Levi Miller is in the Silver City New Mexico photograph but because of slight blurring in the photograph he could not emphatically say it was Levi Miller like he did Maggie Keays.
10- Furia is shown multiple pictures of Brushy Bill Roberts at various stages of life and compared it to the Silver City New Mexico photo. Where I have issue at this point is Edwards using (among the photographs) was 2 picture of one of the Rough Riders, telling Furia that they're all the same man, and Furia does not once counter that narrative. The Rough Riders picture has NEVER been proven to be Roberts, and shouldn't have been included. That casts doubt itself on Furia saying Brushy Bill Roberts was a match to the Silver City New Mexico photograph. Edwards should've only used only known pictures that are proof positive of Brushy Bill Roberts. It raises more questions than answers about Furia's capabilities, or the power of suggestion influencing expert opinion.
11- The Silver City New Mexico photo was then compared to the famous tintype and he ruled in favor of the tintype being a match to the Silver City New Mexico photo.
12-
Conclusion: Edwards, in my opinion, overplayed his hand and unfortunately tainted the expert opinion of Furia by interjecting the Rough Riders photos and Roberts photos into the analysis. What needs to be done is a second opinion from a university or department, with no connection to Dan Edwards. I suggest the couple in Canada need to take the photo to their local university department of history and have them use their own panel of experts to prove the photo is Billy The Kid, Levi Miller and Maggie Keays. I think the provenance is there (photo in Canada nearby where Keays grew up) to give it credibility, but Edwards jumped the gun on the whole issue.
Jesus Christ Almighty God bless you all
