Spanish American War Medal

[wannabe12]

I know this has been discussed in many threads on this board, but wanted to start fresh on this idea. I have received the serial lists for the Service Medals and Combat ( Campaign) Medals awarded for the men who served in Cuba, and those who only served during the war, but never saw action in Cuba. I have gone through nearly all of the records related to the Medal that is shown in many publications as proof that Brushy served as a Rough Rider. This Medal is a Service Medal and awarded to those who saw no action in Cuba. The proof of this has been shown many times on here, the difference is obvious. They are definitely two seperate Medals. I have been through roughly 12,000 of the 17,000 names on this list, I may find Brushy in the remaining 4500 or so names, I may not. I will start on the Campaign Medals List next to see if maybe the wrong Medal was shown in these publications, and to do fair research on the issue. That list also contains 16,000 to 18,000 names. I will also go through the Medals awarded to those who served in the Mexican Border Campaign during WWI. These Medals resemble very closely Service Medals awarded for the SPANAM war, since this is when Brushy as Oliver Roberts registered for the draft in 1918, it would only be right to research this list as well.

[wannabe12]

I did want to add, I have found a William H. Roberts on the Service Medal List. This William H. is living in Philadelphia in 1920 when his Medal was awarded to him. It gives no Unit information, but his Medal is # 5307. Also listed is William J. Roberts, from Missouri. Medal # 5766. I believe this may be the William J. that is thrown about as a possible alias for Brushy.

[wannabe12]

Possible pension application William H Roberts of Pennsylvania, for service in Spanish American War. Listed on ancestry.com, under Pennsylvania,Spanish American War compensation, 1898-1934. 

[wannabe12]

A little info on a Bob tail discharge. Any info I can find states that any type of dishonorable discharge would make a soldier ineligible for any awards or medals that would otherwise be given for service.

"Bob" -a dishonorable discharge from the service. To receive a "bob" or to be "bobbed" was to get a dishonorable discharge. "Bobtail" is the Indian Wars slang for a dishonorable discharge. "His bobtail's coming back by mail, O'Reilly's gone to hell."

In Paul Dickson's book, War Slang...we read: "bobtailed. Dishonorably discharged; from the practice of removing ("bobbing") the portion of discharge papers that confers honor. Dickson, Paul. War Slang...Pocket Books, 1994, page 44. Also the act of cutting off the discharge below the character section denoted "no character." Rickey, Forty Miles a Day on Beans and Hay.
Elting's "A Dictionary of Soldier Talk" features the definition "bobtailed discharge-bobtail (Old, Old Army). A discharge from the service under less than honorable conditions. Not a dishonorable discharge, but the next thing to it. The term came from the practice of clipping off the final section of the discharge form, which covered the dischargee's character. In World War II called a 'discharge without honor.'



Article Source: EzineArticles.com/998349

[mckinley412]

I searched a few of the William Roberts. He would have used Oliver Roberts. I didn't look at those. I think I have the William Roberts covered pretty well. Just look for the Oliver Roberts.

[wannabe12]

So ive gotten through all but 1500 names on the Service Medal List that would match the Medal shown in multiple books detailing Brushy's story. Zero, Oliver Roberts'.. As I said before a few Williams but none from anywhere near where Brushy puts himself at anytime. It is doubtful he used an alias when/if he served. He would have no way of knowing in 1898, that in the 1920's he would recieve a Medal for his service, making it impossible for him to recieve it unless he used his own name, or the Service Medal is not his. I will search the other lists as well. Did this Medal appear in the Morrison book?? or just in later publications??

[wannabe12]

The reason im asking when it first appeared is because, from what I have read, Mr. Morrison took possession of Brushy's trunk to have the evidence he needed to prove his claim. Along with other items in the trunk, Mr. Morrison found the Medal, and Brushy's wife had never seen it before. The Medal does not appear in my digital copy of Alias Billy The Kid, and there is no mention of it in the book. Why would Mr. Morrison not put this in as proof of what Brushy says happened with the Rough Riders?? To totally ommit this makes no sense, unless the photo is something that appeared much later, and is not from Brushy's belongings. Other items that were claimed to be in the trunk are also not in the book or any book. The scarf being one of them, but it is claimed that it was in there when Mr. Morrison took possession of it.

[mckinley412]

I don't think Morrison took possession of anything. Later I know he wrote to someone hoping they had some of the items but nobody could find any. He thought maybe Dewitt Travis family had some things but finally he decided Brushy must have destroyed some of his stuff.

[Texas Truth Teller]

The medal is mentioned in the 2012 book, "Billy the Kid, the Lost Interviews". The widow, Lizzie Roberts, brought a trunk from Hico to Temple, Texas. After her death, the trunk went to her son, William Allison (1907 - 1943), and then to his son, William Allison Jr. (1929 - 1996). Not long before the death of William Allison Jr., Frederic Bean presumably saw the contents of the trunk, although the contents of the trunk were not described until 18 years later on pp32-33 of "Billy the Kid, the Lost Interviews". This is Jameson's description of one item found in the trunk: "A service medal. It was eventually learned that this medal was given to participants in Teddy Roosevelt's Cuban campaign."

[wannabe12]

Thanks for the responses. I got the two confused. Why would Brushy not show Morrison the contents of the trunk? It would be valuable in proving who he was. Why no pictures of the other items in the trunk?? No description given til much later??

[mckinley412]

From reading the Morrison letters you can see that he was only interested in cold hard facts for trial. Some things he wasn't interested in yet because it wasn't hard evidence. He had a very strict guidelines that he was following. That's one answer.

But then he does suggest that Brushy owned an item that could prove his identity and I don't know why they would not have brought that. Possibly because they were only going to an interview with the Governor to see what would be what later down the road at a more official trial. They were feeling the situation out first to see if Brushy would be in any trouble. Leaving the proof hidden for the time being. But then Brushy died unexpectedly. I think he does mention his intentions if Brushy had not died. I'd have to brushy up on some of those letters tho, I'm a bit rusty.

[wannabe12]

I agree with that for the pardon application, but the book was written after Brushy passed away. Does Morrison ever mention Brushy having the trunk? Just seems odd that Brushy wouldn’t have brought all of it out to show Morrison. Obviously for Brushy to allow him to apply for a pardon, he trusted Morrison. The scarf would be a big piece of evidence to bring out to prove that was a factual part of his story, but I don’t remember reading about that happening in Alias Billy the Kid.

[mckinley412]

The scarf would not have proved anything. That's what I mean about things Morrison was not interested in from a legal standpoint. After Brushy died he was curious about what happened to it and other things but the stuff couldn't be found. Have you went to the Brushy group on Facebook and clicked on photos? (you have to be on a computer to do it as far as I know.) Read all of his letters. I guess I've I looked at hundreds or thousands but those are the most interesting ones. (I wanted to post them on this site but computer or site will not allow me to because of technical computer stuff. I don't if Morrison mentioned specifically the word trunk and one lady told me it was a shoe box. There is Sonnichsen's in El Paso that I haven't looked at. Does anyone in the group live in El Paso? Wayne, do you know? I really like to see some of that stuff.

[mckinley412]

Supposedly Brushy gave the shoebox to some friends around Ft. Worth. The lady couldn't remember the name. I'm guessing it was Allison's and maybe that was all the stuff Fredrick Bean found and there is nothing else. Mr. Bean, Mr. Allison, his son also have all passed away I think. I've tried some to find it. I did find a couple letters from Morrison that you can't find in the archives anywhere I'm pretty sure. Morrison says Brushy had pics of Fred Wayte too but I don't know if the one in the book came from Brushy. If it did then it matches the other Fred Wayte photo EXACTLY.

[wannabe12]

My point of bringing the scarf up was only to show the absence of any material objects Brushy could have used as verification of his story. His teeth, scarf,anything that would point towards him being Billy. Records were not easy to find in the 40’s and 50’s as they are still somewhat hard to locate today. So only going on those alone would be hard to convince many people at that time. I am still skeptical of what Brushy actually said and what has been added over the years by various authors to build on the story, to attract new readers on the subject. Many if not all books written on Brushy have used most or all of the material in Alias Billy the Kid, with very little concrete new evidence to make a difference. Rehashing the same facts is what many Brushy supporters accuse the non believers of, adding in a few what ifs and maybes to keep people interested doesn’t make it new evidence.