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Post by DRock on Dec 28, 2018 0:04:24 GMT -5
@sbeck Sorry for the two-year response. I've been working on a television show called "The County" that I'm trying to sell. It's about the relationship between Jesse Evans and Billy. It's kind of a buddy story of how friends became rivals and their eventual reconciliation. I plan on showing my view of what really happened to them. The pilot is already written and I plan on posting it in this thread so that everyone can read it and give input. In my opinion, Brushy was not Billy. There are just way too many red flags surrounding his death. susan do you have the archived newspaper article about Jesse? I'm trying to gather as much information about him as I can. As far as what happened to Billy, they killed an innocent man and passed it off as him (pretty messed up really) There was a reason why Pat Garrett wasn't re-elected as Sheriff and why he never collected the reward money for killing Billy. Friends with Billy prior to becoming Sheriff, gone when Billy escaped, the mysterious gun left in the outhouse, lied about how his own deputy was killed to cover up his role in the escape, lied about how Billy was killed, buried the body as quick as possible and didn't attempt to get a photograph, his own man said he shot the wrong person, closet newspaper reporter had sources telling him the man was a bearded Mexican with stained skinned, I could go on and on and on. Lies on top of lies on top of lies. It was nothing more than a cold-blooded murder to set Billy free. Yes Pat tried to catch Billy and they fought it out but they had respect for each other and I don't think Pat thought that Billy should be the only one that should be hung for all that happened in the Lincoln County War. Better to leave and gun in the outhouse and let his old friend hold court in the street.
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Post by susan on Dec 28, 2018 16:05:11 GMT -5
I have the article but cannot find it. However, it is in the Kansas Record, November 10, 1871. You can probably find it with that info. It states that Allen was the counterfeiter from Montgomery County and he was sent to the penitentiary for 1 year and Jessie was fined $500 and costs.
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Post by clydec on Dec 31, 2018 8:13:55 GMT -5
DRock, if not Brushy then what do you think happened to Billy after that night in Fort Sumner? John Miller was mot Billy in my opinion, but I still believe Brushy was.
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Post by chivato88 on Jan 19, 2019 17:20:10 GMT -5
Hello all, Im all new member here and Ive read almost all of your input that you gave, I believe that Brushy was the Kid from what Ive read about Pat Garrett killing the Kid, they're was a reason why the state of NM would't pay the reward money to Garrett.He (Garrett)also had money problems after the Kids death, my opinion is that he had money problems all is life. Im anxious for reading new stuff from you guys. Sorry about my grammar Im french Canadian lol
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Post by Deleted on Jan 20, 2019 4:37:26 GMT -5
Hello Chivato88 - your English is most likely much better than our French!
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Post by mckinley412 on Feb 13, 2019 0:40:45 GMT -5
Pat originally wasnt paid the 500 because the new governor didnt feel obligated. But he was eventually given the 500 reward and it is documented, on file with the state of New Mexico.
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Post by kerry on Aug 29, 2020 2:38:52 GMT -5
Long after Pat's death-Poe called him a Lawman of integrity - as undoubtably Poe was..yet although Garrett had a copy of the tin type -he didn't show it to Poe who couldn't identify the man who got past him on the porch...Poe followed him to the doorway where he stopped and heard everything said inside - after the usual challenge in Spanish -according to Poe -the man asked Pete Maxwell who those fellows were outside in English then was shot.Pat claimed he fired after Maxwell said <that's him!> Pat said Maxwell was first out the door -Poe said it was Garrett and that he nearly shot Maxwell when he came out after Pat. Poe explained the second shot sounding like two because it rebounded of the adobe wall...striking the headboard of the bed.No mention of the Lawmen having viewed the body otherthan by candle light or taking custody of the body for return to Lincoln -obviously the legend of Charles Goodnight retrieving Loving from Fort Sumner's cemetery -a year after his death-and taking him 300 miles back home to Texas on a buckboard loaded with gravel...didn't appeal -even though they were less that 100 miles from their destination...Poe was one of few Lawmen who hadn't stole horses or cattle -or profited from some other vice...his view of LCW was unsympathetic to the Regulators and to BTK in paticular...Poe seemed to find success and respect in the community throughout his life and was held in high regard by none other than Goodnight himself.
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Post by tboor74 on Oct 16, 2020 8:56:58 GMT -5
What's the provenance of Frank Coe saying in latter years he could saddle up at sunrise and eat supper with the Kid by sundown. Why would he ever come out with that if he didn't know that Billy was still alive?
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Post by MissyS on Jul 21, 2022 18:14:54 GMT -5
I don't remember the names of the interviewers or the dates it happened, but I've seen seemingly accurate reports that Deluvina was interviewed at least twice after the killing. As I understand it, she first claimed she was the first one in the room that night to find the Kid's body on the floor, that she picked up his gun and put it in the drawer (why she would do that, I have no idea!). However, in the second interview some years later, she supposedly denied that she had ever seen the Kid's body that night. Still others say she was there that night and that she yelled at Garrett, "You've killed my boy" or something close to that while pounding his chest with her fists. There are also stories that she had a son and that he disappeared around that time and was never heard from again. There was an interview taken in 1938 of an old timer named Charles Rouark, where he mentions the Maxwell’s cook’s grandson was never seen again after the shooting, although the cook’s name was not mentioned in the interview, reading about it sounded like Deluvina. That interview can be read on the Library of Congress; “Early Days in Lincoln County” manuscript, also this site has many of the interviews of the New Mexico old timers. So it may be Deluvina’s grandson instead of the son that disappeared? I don’t know how old Deluvina was, if she was even old enough to have had a grandson?
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Post by PaddyRobertsTX on Jul 22, 2022 4:22:24 GMT -5
Deluvina was around 22 when Garratt 'killed' Billy, so nowhere near old enough to have a grandchild - even by 1880s standards! there were always a lot of people in and around the Maxwell house so either the barlow story or a random ended up in the grave.
i will keep going back through old journals and see if i can come up with a name for the cook as that could be a link to follow, but Fort Sumner was a decent place on a well trodden route - there would have been a lot of drifters, opportunists and loners who could have been used as a fake Billy. We know Garrett had prewritten documents for the jury to sign, we know that despite having just shot the most wanted man in pretty much anywhere west of the Mississippi he chose not to photograph himself with the body (a regular act for bounty hunters) but buried it asap.
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Post by MissyS on Jul 22, 2022 23:28:45 GMT -5
Deluvina was around 22 when Garratt 'killed' Billy, so nowhere near old enough to have a grandchild - even by 1880s standards! there were always a lot of people in and around the Maxwell house so either the barlow story or a random ended up in the grave. i will keep going back through old journals and see if i can come up with a name for the cook as that could be a link to follow, but Fort Sumner was a decent place on a well trodden route - there would have been a lot of drifters, opportunists and loners who could have been used as a fake Billy. We know Garrett had prewritten documents for the jury to sign, we know that despite having just shot the most wanted man in pretty much anywhere west of the Mississippi he chose not to photograph himself with the body (a regular act for bounty hunters) but buried it asap. Interesting, I didn’t know her age in 1881. The only reason I thought the cook in the article was referring to Deluvina was because of the description about the cook putting flowers on the Kid’s grave a lot but that could very well have been someone other than Deluvina. Charles Rouark was 78 at the time of the interview so his recollections may not have been all that sharp, I don’t know? Since Deluvina was around 22, she wouldn’t have had a son Billy’s age either to get mistaken for the Kid.
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Post by PaddyRobertsTX on Jul 23, 2022 6:38:21 GMT -5
The reports of the cook putting flowers does suggest it could have been the cooks son that was shot? Have made some time to read through the journals more today so perhaps I can find something extra or I've missed something.
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Post by cassandra jane on Jul 23, 2022 13:12:28 GMT -5
The reports of the cook putting flowers does suggest it could have been the cooks son that was shot? Have made some time to read through the journals more today so perhaps I can find something extra or I've missed something. Which journals are you using for your research? I’m sure some of us on the board would be able to help sift through them to give you a few more pairs of eyes.
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Post by PaddyRobertsTX on Jul 23, 2022 15:32:11 GMT -5
Mixture of research and some old family stuff,most of mine is written in numerous notebooks and some of the old stuff I'm still trying to piece together fully
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Post by PaddyRobertsTX on Jul 26, 2022 9:22:27 GMT -5
Hoping someone on here who has done some reading might be able to help me with a few names that have come up in these journals. Theres some references to Harralson, Cortese and a Charlie Timm. Theres also a reference to being owed money by Billy Davis (tough name to trace!) but hoping these may have appeared in someones digging over the years. Thanks!!!
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